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problems in timing the hands together

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VictorCS
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Post by beaver92 Mon Aug 24, 2009 1:08 pm

hello.. i have a problem that i haven't yet solved.. i have been playing for 2 or three weeks now.. so i am a beginner .. i have been trying scales, the major chords and tring the minor and the dominant and diminshed 7th..
i have been trying some songs too.. i can do the intro to apologize with two hands..

and here comes my problem : i have been learning comptine d'un autre ete.. i can do the left hand and the right hand but i can't get them together.. i have this problems in other songs too.. i can cope with rigid chords coming in at intervals together with the right hand, but i can't seem to manage to get a diffrent rithm to my left hand.. are there any triks or exercises to get getter at this? i sort of need to make the notes of the left hand coinside with notes of the right to get it .. but in that way it doesen't sound right..
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Post by ROBIN Mon Aug 24, 2009 1:38 pm

hi beaver ..the only real answer to your question is practise ...slowwly at first and then gradually build speed to correct timing ...but you have got to be very slow at first it may be tedious but once you crack it , it will be worth yuor effort i have just learned this piece and really enjoy playing it ...it is quiet easy once you get through the barrier of both hands but i was like you at first ...you have got to nail both left and right hand seperately first and it should get easier ..hope this helps ya mate also just section it off a small bit at a time but remember to be slow and patient Smile

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Post by aendym Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:21 pm

Ive noticed that if you practise part on both left and right hand seperatly over and over and over again until you can do it automatically without thinking about it, thats the best time to put both hands together, cause then you dont have to concentrate on playing the right keys and you can fully concentrate on getting the correct rhyth. and as robin said, youll get it if you start out REALLY REALLY slowly!

Other than that... I loooooove that piece, but isnt it almost a bit difficult for a beginner? Ive only been playing for 3 weeks now and dont think Id be able to play that. On the other hand, it is always the same rhythm for the left hand, isnt it? Hmmm... Im gonna have to try it! sunny


Last edited by aendym on Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:24 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by beaver92 Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:23 pm

i shall go on with practice then. just one more thing.. do i have to think about a timing with the hands or am i supposed to play both hand like if i was playing the seperatly?
i mean is is like.. right hand plays c SO left hand plays F or is it just two diffrent hand playing together?
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Post by ROBIN Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:28 pm

HI beaver ..if you look at the music on the sheet you should see where notes hit at same time and ..but first make sure you can play the parts on left and right seperate comfortably then move to play together but take your time ..both played at same speed ...slowly than your speed will grow with confidence

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Post by beaver92 Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:32 pm

ok thanks.. i'll be going back to practicing !
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Post by ROBIN Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:37 pm

HEHE good luck mate i am sure you will learn this just persist and it will come together eventually ...i also found this song very gd execise for both hands ,it has built a lot of stamina in my left hand and it works the right hand with those sets of small arpeggios Smile

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Post by endre Mon Aug 24, 2009 3:42 pm

Honestly I am not sure how it is being done. I'm pretty new in the 2 hand thing (unison stuff doesn't count), but to be honest whatever I learnt so far I'm not sure how I did it. After a while it just works together kinda, I couldn't say I am focusing on each note on both hands I can't do that, but my hands are faster than my brain sort of and they know what to do - weirdest feeling...
While I do have some overall awareness of what I play, If I had to focus and be "aware" of each note I play I couldn't do it... can't explain.. not sure if others have the same experience or it's just me...

Edit: Isn't that way too hard for beginners? What version are you learning? Maybe you can PM me a link to it or something. The one I seen and have is a bit difficult (maybe would be time for me to learn it) but I do still have problems with the octave-wide left hand accompaniment, as in, I kinda mess it up hitting wrong keys etc if I have to play an octave wide. (so far)

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Post by aendym Mon Aug 24, 2009 4:12 pm

Hey endre! I totally know what you mean. Parts that I can actually play really good by now seem to just go by themselves. Quick parts, in which the right hand has the melody and the other plays slower feel like I couldnt even stop my fingers from moving by themselves... sometimes my hands go so quick that Im not even able to slow them down anymore...like Ive lost complete control of my hands. and the worst is when the right hand is really way too fast for the left hand or the other way around... its really the strangest feeling.
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Post by endre Mon Aug 24, 2009 4:20 pm

This problem with the 2 hands reminded me something I seen recently:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pf2accwGEaU

Just some sort of improvisation, the guy is switching between pieces etc (some piano test not an official recording). But what that dude does with his hands is pretty sick, especially considering he wasn't even showing off for the public ... off topic I know just wanted to share for some entertainment >p

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Post by VictorCS Mon Aug 24, 2009 11:28 pm

You cant really focus on each note, but a group of notes. Just think and your brain will activate the muscles in a magical way. It's almost like "you can think about moving your arm without doing it", brain is weird.

When you play a chord/arpeggio you dont think first A, second C, third D and fourth G. It's more like you think ACDG solid or ACDG arpeggio. But you dont think you think that either. It seems the brain just thinks for itself sometimes ^_^

It's not much thinking involved in improvisation either, it just flows. ( i'm still not a huge improviser, i dont have a pocket knife yet to macgyverism the piano )
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Post by Cloudy Tue Aug 25, 2009 11:24 pm

VictorCS wrote:You cant really focus on each note, but a group of notes. Just think and your brain will activate the muscles in a magical way. It's almost like "you can think about moving your arm without doing it", brain is weird.

When you play a chord/arpeggio you dont think first A, second C, third D and fourth G. It's more like you think ACDG solid or ACDG arpeggio. But you dont think you think that either. It seems the brain just thinks for itself sometimes ^_^

It's not much thinking involved in improvisation either, it just flows. ( i'm still not a huge improviser, i dont have a pocket knife yet to macgyverism the piano )

lol! i had to read it 5 times before i got it. duuuuhhhh Suspect
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Post by beaver92 Sat Sep 12, 2009 5:09 pm

hello guys.. have been practicing for a wile now and i can say i have got much better, i yet don't have the fluidity would likje but after playing time after time the piece slowly focusing on both hands and the notes hit together i can now play little bits of the song flkuidly.. but my mind isn't very good yet.. but i have time XD
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Post by ROBIN Sat Sep 12, 2009 5:43 pm

great news to hear of your improvement ,just keep at it and your fluidity will come ...if you have a copy of the music itself try playing along to it, this may help you with timing and dynamics ..i copied the music onto finale n\pad and used to play along with it ...as you can adjust tempo of music to suit your speed ..so keep it up m8 Smile

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Post by Tryder Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:49 pm

Hello everyone, I'm new to the game and am excited to be here! 1st I just wanna say that my hands also have a mind of it's own at times. Piano is going to come easy for me considering that I know how to type. So I know the feeling of how weird it can be how your hands or brain know where to go without having to really think to hard.

2nd, and this is for ROBIN; QUOTE: "i copied the music onto finale n\pad and used to play along with it". May I ask, what is this you speak of?

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Post by Tryder Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:52 pm

I'm guessing that it's some sort of software like FL or what not, right?

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Post by ROBIN Thu Sep 17, 2009 5:14 am

hi and welcome to forum tryder ...yes Finale Notepad is a software prog...that lets you compose and print out your musical ideas ..best is to try it out on demo first ..i bought it for 10dollars after i tested for 30 days http://www.finalemusic.com/you will find it here ...ther are others to like (musescore) wich is free it is up to you which suits you .they are both music notation progs ..but you will them vry useful once you get the hang of using them which doesnt take long ..they help me if i need to work on particular parts of muusic that i need to to hear and slow down..you can also import midi songs from internet which will be shown as music notation ..also i found by copying music over to notepad has helped with general music theory for me ..give it a try ..and gl with your hands together practise ...in the words of our mod Thomandy ...SLOW and PRECISE at first and speed and timing will come ..hope this helps ya Smile

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Post by Tryder Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:08 am

Thanks Robin, that was a wonderful reply mite I say! I use to think, "why would I need midi songs when I already know how to put a song together". You've just helped me realize that using midi songs could benefit by utilizing software's such as the one you speak of OR something similar(in that way) like "Pro.tools", (which by the way I have so, I think I'll start doing that pretty soon) that allow you to print out notation.


Thanks again for the welcome, appreciate it!

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Post by ROBIN Thu Sep 17, 2009 7:51 am

Hi tryder glad info has helped you a little on your way Smile

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Post by learningpiano80 Mon Sep 21, 2009 9:57 am

aendym wrote:Ive noticed that if you practise part on both left and right hand seperatly over and over and over again until you can do it automatically without thinking about it, thats the best time to put both hands together, cause then you dont have to concentrate on playing the right keys and you can fully concentrate on getting the correct rhyth.

Actually some learning techniques which are good for one don't have to be perfect for someone else. So, I started learning with two hands instantly. I did this, because I realized, that I'm not able to play the rythm of two hands perfectly and so I would have large difficulties in putting two hands together, because I couldln't synchronize them afterwars. It's almost impossible for me to learn the hands seperately.

Imho learning with two hands from the beginning is like linking both hands real hard together. The two hands mustn't play independet, because the two hands of a piece I would like to play aren't independant as well.

In this way I experienced that I stop BOTH hands if one of both isn't sure which note to play next and it stops. Otherwise one would play and the other would get lost.

Hope you understand, what I wrote Smile

Thomas

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Post by eVerlasting Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:39 am

Ye thats what i have too xD The other thing when i have to play long note like pressing 1 key for 5 sec on the right hand and doing fast beat on the left hand i usually also accidently " beat" with the right hand xD
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