How exactly do digital piano's/Keyboards work?

I partly posted this because this forum is strangely empty

And because I am genuinly fascinated by how they work. All i know is you press a key and it hits some kind of sensor, witchcraft happens, and the speakers make a pleasent noise, in the space of about a millisecond

anyone care to enlighten me?

First off, read this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_piano

Pricetx wrote:
witchcraft happens,?

lol yes digital pianos use an advanced form of black magic that's how they work so well. Didn't everyone know that?

well...now that we know how digital pianoes work ...can anyoane tell me how to make a very old KORG to sound how it should. at this moment it's somwhere in between a piano and a broken violin (i might be exagerating though) i can hear something's wrong but i just don't know what....assuming it's not because of my playing

Very old Korg is kind of vague. Can you be more specific? Is it a digital piano? What model? Digital pianos don't go out fo tune, so you either have access to tweaking the sound and messed the original or there is some malfunction in the whole system making it sound bad. I would guess some electrical issue. Does it have built-in speakers? Stereo out? Headphone out? Does it sound the same regardless of which you select?

If all is lost and you have midi out, try getting pianoteq and you'll be amazed.

here are some pics of "the thing"... i'm using a set of speakers usually for pc ..tey're not the best either and i guess this might be a broblem too

Can't see any model number/name. It looks to be some kind of drawbar model and has some tuning capabilities? Maybe that's what sounds bad? Or that signal out, high Low, if it's for impedance, but that is strange. Try to find the model an from there look up the manual online.

Play around with: Overdrive, Bass, and treble switches.. Those should change the sound into what your looking for. GL

Phobik2000 wrote:Can't see any model number/name. It looks to be some kind of drawbar model and has some tuning capabilities? Maybe that's what sounds bad? Or that signal out, high Low, if it's for impedance, but that is strange. Try to find the model an from there look up the manual online.

it has nothing more written on it...and i searched for whatever detail wich could help me but that's all the information i have. i'm not very cood at technical stuff either. well...i guess i'll figure this out someday i couldn't find any resembling model on the internet

pianohama wrote:Play around with: Overdrive, Bass, and treble switches.. Those should change the sound into what your looking for. GL

i've already done that...
Thank you guys anyway

mia wrote:well...now that we know how digital pianoes work ...can anyoane tell me how to make a very old KORG to sound how it should. at this moment it's somwhere in between a piano and a broken violin (i might be exagerating though) i can hear something's wrong but i just don't know what....assuming it's not because of my playing

Right... So, that is not a digital piano, that's a digital drawbar organ, and (probably to surprise you) a DAMN GOOD ONE!
The model is CX3, and it's a clone made by Korg to imitate the sound of an Hammond B3 (the most famous of the digital organs). In case you don't know, the Hammond B3 is used by Jon Lord from Deep Purple, and also the keyboard player from The Doors (which I forgot the name)

Here, I found one for sale (check out the price):
http://www.wwbw.com/Korg-CX3-Digital-Drawbar-Organ-i19489.music

Also, check out the sounds this monster can produce:



Well, and of course, if you want a good piano sound you won't get it from this organ, as that is not it's purpose. However, keep in mind that the organ sound you can get is a very very good one, so if you're interested in learning an organ, you probably can't get much better than that (other than an Hammond, but that would be VERY expensive).
On the other hand, if you don't like the sound of an organ, you can sell it for a good price and get yourself a pretty decent digital piano (or an upright, if you prefer). Just keep in mind that once you sell it, you probably won't get to buy it back EVER

wamaral wrote:

mia wrote:well...now that we know how digital pianoes work ...can anyoane tell me how to make a very old KORG to sound how it should. at this moment it's somwhere in between a piano and a broken violin (i might be exagerating though) i can hear something's wrong but i just don't know what....assuming it's not because of my playing

Right... So, that is not a digital piano, that's a digital drawbar organ, and (probably to surprise you) a DAMN GOOD ONE!
The model is CX3, and it's a clone made by Korg to imitate the sound of an Hammond B3 (the most famous of the digital organs). In case you don't know, the Hammond B3 is used by Jon Lord from Deep Purple, and also the keyboard player from The Doors (which I forgot the name)



Well, and of course, if you want a good piano sound you won't get it from this organ, as that is not it's purpose. However, keep in mind that the organ sound you can get is a very very good one, so if you're interested in learning an organ, you probably can't get much better than that (other than an Hammond, but that would be VERY expensive).
On the other hand, if you don't like the sound of an organ, you can sell it for a good price and get yourself a pretty decent digital piano (or an upright, if you prefer). Just keep in mind that once you sell it, you probably won't get to buy it back EVER

whoa!!! you really made my day ! i had no ideea...thanx a lot XOXO \/

Hi everyone!

I'm new here so I felt shy about starting a new topic. I seriously want to learn to play piano but all I have is a very old keyboard, so my question is;

Is it better to buy a regular piano or a digital piano? Which would you guys recommend considering I can't spend more than... lets say about $400? (I guess this part is for you guys that live in USA, this place is amazingly international, I love it!)

Thank you so much and sorry to barge in like this in the middle of your discussion.

But, not thinking about any other details; Piano or Digital Piano?

hello! :)well you can go for a digital one 'cause i belive it's easier for a begginner because digital pianos don't go out of tune. even if i like piano more because it has a wormer sound...it's your choice after all(if you want more information on digital oneas see this topic http://afpa.hooxs.com/general-piano-discussion-f4/keyboard-or-digital-piano-t825.htm
by the way love your pic

lunazul wrote:But, not thinking about any other details; Piano or Digital Piano?

You'll find everything you need there : http://afpa.hooxs.com/general-piano-discussion-f4/why-a-grand-why-a-digital-t93.htm?highlight=digital+piano

For about 400 you dont get much more than a keyboard, for a decent digital piano you'll have to pay atleast about 1200usd. Sure you can get cheaper digital piano's, but I wouldnt buy the cheapest.

Ofcourse, the prices in the US is epic low, sadly it doesnt really help me if I buy from there, because of taxes and &$^# they add when it comes across the border. And now the dollar is gettin stronger too

If you want a piano, 400 bucks wont hold, if it does, it has to be old, and the owner just wanna throw it out. But you can get a nice keyboard for that money, dont know if you can get weighted keys for the money, but 400 is enough for a decent keyboard + I bet you get alittle more for your money, compared to my country who robs everyone ^_^

VictorCS wrote:compared to my country who robs everyone ^_^

Hehe, why Man !!

Thank you so much!! I'll go right now and check the topic.

If you think a digital piano is almost as good as a real one I might as well buy me one of those, I've seen them for less than that amount of money, 88 keys and all.

It's nice to be here. May you all have a great day!!

Oh, thanks Mia, I love kitties

Hello everyone, sorry for this bringing back this old post to life, but i was wondering if anyone knows how the digital piano works? What's explained on the first topics is really very little information. I'd like to know what happens exactly when you press a key. My concern is that if i hit the keys with a bit of strength over time it might wear off whatever it is that sends the signal from the key to the sound columns and lose sensibility, and i'd like this digital piano to last for some time in good condition. Does anyone know anything about this?

Thanks in advance.

Dre

I have no clue how they work. BUT, I do know that any half decent diggy-piano wont wear off for quite sometime. They should be able to take a fair amount of abuse .

The short answer is that they work quite well, better than they used to, and further improvements can be expected in the future.

Many/most of the current crop are known as "romplers" a contraction of "rom" (read only memory) and "player" - in other words they are sample players.

Detailed recordings are made of actual pianos.
The keyboard sends messages consisting of note number and velocity via the MIDI protocol to "play" the digitally stored sample sound.
There are "Continuous controllers" for a few things such as damper pedal and pitch bend (not used for "pianos").

Other methods of synthesis are additive & subtractive .....hard to summarize, but the goal is to imitate an instrument by adding various amounts (according to the nature of the instrument) of the overtones to the fundamental and to shape that within an ADSR (attack, delay, sustain, release) envelope.

My math isn't totally up to this, but I understand a square wave to consist of the fundamental plus every overtone.
Subtractive synthesis is used to subtract the unwanted overtones by filtering them out.... something like that.

Well, that is the essence of it (-:

So how do notes get switched off ? I didn't explain that.
Simple enough, a MIDI message is sent when the key is released with the note number and a velocity of zero.

===============================
The drawbar Korg home organ is a whole other subject.
It is most likely an additive synth. (guessing)
There are GENERAL patterns that you can pull the drawbars out to in order to mimic various instruments, e.g. a V pattern, a / or \ pattern.
You can probably get some help on these by looking up Hammond organ literature, there are probably user manuals on line.
The Hammond B3 was a very popular instrument (still is with a special interest group) so manuals(pun) for that are probably around.

Dre wrote:Hello everyone, sorry for this bringing back this old post to life, but i was wondering if anyone knows how the digital piano works? What's explained on the first topics is really very little information. I'd like to know what happens exactly when you press a key. My concern is that if i hit the keys with a bit of strength over time it might wear off whatever it is that sends the signal from the key to the sound columns and lose sensibility, and i'd like this digital piano to last for some time in good condition. Does anyone know anything about this?

Thanks in advance.

Dre

Not sure EXACTLY what hits what (mechanically).
At a guess it is likely something very much like the underside of a computer keyboard, i.e. looks like plastic "bubble wrap".

There is interest in other forums on velocity response curves and it is HARD to get most of them to send velocities over 110 (the MIDI spec max being 127).

One thing you COULD do if you are worried about wear and tear is to play only music that doesn't have any repeated notes in it (hard to find and unlikely to be very musical).
It wouldn't save wear, but would even it out.
You could also be sure to play in every key equally to make sure the black notes take some of the burden off the white ones (-:

Seriously, don't worry about it.
The basic mechanism is used in stage and studio pianos and takes some BEATINGS.

A digital piano is made to be used, worrying about this is like worrying about the hammers in a real piano. There still exist synth and keyboards from way back that still works today.

When you press a key it hits something that transmit an electrical signal to the "brain", sometimes these are velocity sensitive. The "brain" then transmit the signal to whatever it is that transfers the sound out.

I bet you'll have a hard time playing so much that you'll lose sensitivity ^_^

VictorCS wrote:A digital piano is made to be used, worrying about this is like worrying about the hammers in a real piano. There still exist synth and keyboards from way back that still works today.

When you press a key it hits something that transmit an electrical signal to the "brain", sometimes these are velocity sensitive. The "brain" then transmit the signal to whatever it is that transfers the sound out.

I bet you'll have a hard time playing so much that you'll lose sensitivity ^_^

Funny thing is that computer keyboards are about the only ones that are NOT velocity sensitive, but are the ones that most people REALLY try to get expression into by banging harder.

Just about all piano/synth keyboards are velocity sensitive, otherwise there would be no pianissimo or forte.

My KX-88 STILL doesn't have any internally worn keys, not that the key caps are that worn either.
I bought that some time in the mid/late 80s, it has had considerable kid and young adult use.

Thanks for all the replies. The keyboard in question is a yamaha np-30. It's very simple, has very few functions, so i think they concentrated on making it good quality and of course they know how pianists play so, it's been made for that and i shouldn't be worried that much. I'll keep looking though, now that i got curious maybe someone on the electronics department of my college knows...

There is another piano interests forum that has as a sponsor a company that does acoustic piano midi add-ons.
I looked around and.... too many piano forums. haven't found it yet (-:
Anyway, I remember following their ad one time and there was some description of what they add under a regular piano keyboard and what that is made of.

Other searches indicate that the contact medium is "touch film" that is velocity sensitive.
i.e. it is very similar to touch screen laptop screens and keyboards.
The addition of "hammer action" is somewhat independent of this - it is basically there to provide an artifact of the physical keys and hammer mechanisms that were needed to produce sound in struck string instruments - aka pianos (-:
Early computer keyboards were not accepted for lack of their teletype like clicks, so the clicks were added for user acceptance.