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I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

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I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by Shouji on Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:13 am

Seriously, no matter how many times it is explained to me, I still just don't understand anything about it. I mean i'm now pretty proficient in Nocturne in E-Flat Major, but I don't really understand how to follow the 12/8 at all, I just play it how it sounds right.
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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by Casyopea on Wed Jul 02, 2008 3:24 pm

I'm afraid I can't help because I'm kind of a total newbie ... Smile

But my question is, are you feeling better? Give us an update please!

Best,

Elena.
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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by CripKilla on Wed Jul 02, 2008 9:02 pm

For example, 4/4 time signature: it means each bar have 4 quarters notes!
Very Happy 3/4, 3 quarters notes, etc
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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by Thomandy on Wed Jul 02, 2008 9:12 pm

Yeah, basicly what Crips is saying. I can try to tak an example:
Couse you got to take tempo into consideration.

4/4 - tempo 60 bpm(beats pr minute)

This basicly means that every second, since there is 60sec pr minute you got to play a quarter note. And wi are talking about value. Couse if you see a Whole note that is the same as 4 quarter notes, and then that should be held for 4 seconds.

At 60bpm every 4sec a bar stats, when we are talinkg 4/4
At 120bpm every 2sec a bar starts, couse then we got to have room for 120 quarternotes in value pr minute. Thats why we got to play dubble speed than 60bpm.

So to understand fully you should test the metronome. Its a great tool.
Set it to 60 and you will see that the Clicks are every second.

And then transfere it to 3/4 means that at 60bmp you gona play 3quarternotes instead of 4, but it will take the same time to play those 3 as 4(in 4/4) couse of the bmp is the same and the /4 is the same. 3quarternotes will at 60bpm take you 4seconds to play.

I might have made this more difficult then it was, when I read again its a bit messy Razz hehe, but you might get the idea Razz:P

Btw: This goes for 12/8 aswell. At 60bpm you should manage to fit 12 quarternotes, still talking about value, into 8 beats, or since this is a easy example, 8 sec. At 120bpm it would be 8beats still, but in 4 sec. Couse we got twice as many beats.
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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by CripKilla on Thu Jul 03, 2008 1:29 am

Wow! Very Happy good explanation! Wink
By the way Thomas there is something I don't know about time signature and maybe you can answer me: What is the time signature C and C with the bar? It's like 4/4 but...
Thanks! geek
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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by Thomandy on Thu Jul 03, 2008 1:57 am

CripKilla wrote:Wow! Very Happy good explanation! Wink
By the way Thomas there is something I don't know about time signature and maybe you can answer me: What is the time signature C and C with the bar? It's like 4/4 but...
Thanks! geek

Yeah, its exactly the same so It not really anything else to know about that Smile
Historicaly it meant somthing else, it meant somthing "like" 2/4
but today it is used only on 4/4



----------
This is 2/2
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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by boogiewoogie on Sat Jul 26, 2008 1:00 pm

Can anyone explain the difference between say 3/4 and 3/8? Would you play them differently? Is 3/8 faster than 3/4? Why does the composer choose one over the other? Or 4/4, 4/8 - is there a 4/8?

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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by Thomandy on Sat Jul 26, 2008 1:30 pm

boogiewoogie wrote:Can anyone explain the difference between say 3/4 and 3/8? Would you play them differently? Is 3/8 faster than 3/4? Why does the composer choose one over the other? Or 4/4, 4/8 - is there a 4/8?

Read what I wrote above and you might understand timesignatures. If not you need to learn more basic stuff first I think! Smile
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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by maestoso on Sat Aug 23, 2008 12:19 am

Hi, just to compliment what's already been said (great answers!), often the difference between two time signatures is "feel". for example, 3/4 is three distinct quarter beats (we brits call them crotchets!), with a stress on the first beat - very often used for waltz style. 3/8 is ONE beat per bar/measure, which divides into 3 equal eighth notes - 3/4 is therefore "simple triple" time, and 3/8 is "compound triple" (compound means the beat is divided into an uneven number, in this case 3). In Chopin's Eb Nocturne which is in 12/8, you want to feel 4 beats per bar, with the left hand playing 3 even chords on each beat. This could be written in 4/4 with triplets on each beat, would give roughly the same effect. I know it's confusing.... Rolling Eyes

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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by Amro on Sat Aug 23, 2008 10:41 am

So,
Why Did he write it in 4/4 ?!!

confused
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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by maestoso on Sat Aug 23, 2008 11:23 am

The point is the feeling of the music is different between 4/4 and 12/8. In 4/4 there is a STRESS on beat 1 and another small stress on beat 3... in 12/8 there is a stress on each beat equally. By stress I mean the note/ chord is played slightly heavier/ stronger. e.g.
12/8: 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3
4/4: 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3

Hope this makes sense, though it is difficult to describe in writing. These are the small things that make music complicated to understand but make a big difference in the final result of the music.

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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by Amro on Sat Aug 23, 2008 2:00 pm

maestoso wrote:The point is the feeling of the music is different between 4/4 and 12/8. In 4/4 there is a STRESS on beat 1 and another small stress on beat 3... in 12/8 there is a stress on each beat equally. By stress I mean the note/ chord is played slightly heavier/ stronger. e.g.
12/8: 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3
4/4: 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3

Hope this makes sense, though it is difficult to describe in writing. These are the small things that make music complicated to understand but make a big difference in the final result of the music.

Yeah !!
That makes sense ..

I Got it Very Happy
But its more difficult than the 4/4 .. Mad

Thanks,
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Re: I still pathetically do not understand time signatures...

Post by maestoso on Sat Aug 23, 2008 3:11 pm

definitely agree!! Cool

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