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Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

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Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by VictorCS on Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:09 pm

Ok, so I have this problem, I can improvise a melody line, but my problem starts with the chords....
Right now when I play with improvisation, I play the melody line together with a alberti pattern...

Or another simple pattern for the chord... Lets say I play the C harmonic minor scale, then I usually play the C minor chord ( C Eb G ),
in a simple rythm, but this is quite limiting, it's like i'm stuck with the C minor chord...
So I need a way to use my lefthand better, a repeating pattern isnt more than just ok...

And my next question, what is the relationship between the chords I can use and the scales I can use? As in "what the rules says is perfect"....
Right now when I play a C scale, I play a C chord, and when I play a D scale, I play a D chord.... Is this how it should be?
If I just play in the C scale, through the whole song, I can only play a C chord as a bass pattern? Is that true? If I play in C my chord has to be C?
So then I'll actually have to change the scale each time I change the chord?

I hope there is an easy way to explain this, because I feel quite flat when I cant get my lefthand to play something that adds fatness to the right melody hand lol!
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by pianohama on Thu Jun 12, 2008 11:21 pm

That is not true Smile

every note in a scale can create a chord. Theres 7 tones in a scale therefore u get 7 chords Smile

In C minor u can use the chords Cm, Ddim, Eb, Fm, Gm, Ab, Bb

And then theres more chords for the more advanced scale such as the harmonic, you get a G major instead of a g minor =) (and some more stuff i'm to tired to explain right now)
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by VictorCS on Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:03 pm

I tryied out playing the scale with other chords, and it works....
I found JGuitar.com, a page alot of scales, and chords that can be playd together with the scale...

I know it's for the guitar, but it works on the piano aswell Razz

My next problem is what do I do with my left hand? I cant stick with a boring bass pattern....
I need alittle pattern help, I know pianohama isnt the only one improvising here,
so alittle help from everybody would be great ^_^
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by Phi on Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:51 pm

VictorCS wrote:

My next problem is what do I do with my left hand? I cant stick with a boring bass pattern....

You could play an arpeggio with your left hand. Makes it more interesting.

What I do, is play the 1st, 3rd, 8th, 9th and 10th.

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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by pianohama on Fri Jun 13, 2008 5:02 pm

VictorCS wrote:I tryied out playing the scale with other chords, and it works....
I found JGuitar.com, a page alot of scales, and chords that can be playd together with the scale...

I know it's for the guitar, but it works on the piano aswell Razz

My next problem is what do I do with my left hand? I cant stick with a boring bass pattern....
I need alittle pattern help, I know pianohama isnt the only one improvising here,
so alittle help from everybody would be great ^_^



You can create any chord you like, aslong as you use the keys within the scale =)
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by VictorCS on Fri Jun 13, 2008 5:12 pm

Study, study study

Why didnt they make scale piano's.... ^_^

Then you could just play any key without trying to not hit the wrong keys lol!
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by Thomandy on Fri Jun 13, 2008 6:00 pm

VictorCS wrote:Study, study study

Why didnt they make scale piano's.... ^_^

Then you could just play any key without trying to not hit the wrong keys lol!

Where is the challange in that?? Razz hehe
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by Admin Andrew on Fri Jun 13, 2008 6:25 pm

Actually they did make a "scale piano" as you called it, they have gears that pull the keys around. I don't fully understand them as i've never seen one, but it was explained to me by my piano tuner. so they due exsist, they're just VERY rare

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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by pianohama on Fri Jun 13, 2008 7:34 pm

VictorCS wrote:Study, study study

Why didnt they make scale piano's.... ^_^

Then you could just play any key without trying to not hit the wrong keys lol!

Lol you can still do that man Smile Only using the white keys, and voila u got a scale piano Smile (If u got an electric piano, you can even transpose to other scales =) )
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by VictorCS on Fri Jun 13, 2008 8:09 pm

You actually got 2 scales that are very easy to play on a piano, the white keys ( the Major scale ), and ofcourse the black keys ( the Yo scale ).
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by Thomandy on Fri Jun 13, 2008 8:13 pm

But not all keys sound good toghether within the scales, no matter what scale you stick to! Wink Of course its safe if you only use one hand... Laughing
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by pianohama on Fri Jun 13, 2008 9:10 pm

thomandy wrote:But not all keys sound good toghether within the scales, no matter what scale you stick to! Wink Of course its safe if you only use one hand... Laughing


Actually all scaletones sounds good together except for the halfsteppers Smile Forexample in the scale of C major, B and C doesnt sound good together(unless you play a Cmaj7th chord), or E and F doesnt sound good together because they are only a halftone from eachother in frequency Smile otherwise your good to go =)
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by Thomandy on Fri Jun 13, 2008 9:27 pm

pianohama wrote:
thomandy wrote:But not all keys sound good toghether within the scales, no matter what scale you stick to! Wink Of course its safe if you only use one hand... Laughing


Actually all scaletones sounds good together except for the halfsteppers Smile Forexample in the scale of C major, B and C doesnt sound good together(unless you play a Cmaj7th chord), or E and F doesnt sound good together because they are only a halftone from eachother in frequency Smile otherwise your good to go =)

You are probably right Smile But, I sat down and tryed, and feel there are many keys that dosnt sound good toghether Razz
But conserning harmony you are probably right. I havnt read any harmonytheory Smile But sound is also a matter of taste =)
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by VictorCS on Fri Jun 13, 2008 9:50 pm

If you push EF, BC, EF, BC, EF, BC in a steady rythm pretty nice... Mixing disharmony and harmony together is a great way to make tension etc in a piece.

What about the G-B-C-E chord, a chord with neighbour keys, it's making the chord kinda disharmonic, but in a good way ^_^


But what do you guys do with your left hand? play a pattern, or do you playing some random keys?
And how do you get your left hand to play another rythm then your right?
When I start to speed up my right hand, my left follows....
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by Phi on Fri Jun 13, 2008 10:44 pm

VictorCS wrote:If you push EF, BC, EF, BC, EF, BC in a steady rythm pretty nice... Mixing disharmony and harmony together is a great way to make tension etc in a piece.

What about the G-B-C-E chord, a chord with neighbour keys, it's making the chord kinda disharmonic, but in a good way ^_^


But what do you guys do with your left hand? play a pattern, or do you playing some random keys?
And how do you get your left hand to play another rythm then your right?
When I start to speed up my right hand, my left follows....

Most modern pieces consist of arpeggios in the left hand [correct me if I'm wrong]... and I think arpeggios are a good way of making what you're playing more interesting.
For example, while playing the C chord, you could play, C-G-C on your left hand in such a way that it flows with your rhythm.

The G-B-C-E chord is actually the 2nd inversion of the Cmaj7 chord. Smile

You could also use "chord-alternatives" to spice up your playing... For instance, play the Csus2 instead Cmaj chord, or the Csus4 instead of Fmaj as the IV. Smile

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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by Thomandy on Fri Jun 13, 2008 11:30 pm

Phi wrote: and I think arpeggios are a good way of making what you're playing more interesting.

I totally agree!! Smile Actually that was the exact same thing I said only a couple of weeks ago, but I have changed my mind a bit, from what I meant wher the best lefthandplay. I still LOVE arpegios Smile But, I have come to understand that it all depends on the piece and the melody, + the effect the composer wants to/ or wanted to create. In my first composition I use arpegios, but in my new piece I use chords in the same matter as Chopin did in his Prelude in E- Minor. Smile And it is cousing a totally different effect.

So everything for its own useSmile
Well, thats a Norwegian saying translated directly* so I dont know if its as universal of an saying, but it might work Razz
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by VictorCS on Sat Jun 14, 2008 1:25 am

I should study some songs to se how they do the left hand,
and then apply it to my improvs... ^_^

The FF1 pieces are all about the arpeggios and alberti pattern...
Ofcourse it sounds good, but why not learn more...
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Re: Scales vs Chords... Confused ^_^

Post by VictorCS on Mon Jun 16, 2008 1:10 pm

While we're at it, is it was to figure out a chord progression... Because I'm not really good at just picking chords on the fly.
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